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[ท่านผีเพลง]

วันก่อนเปิดแผ่น ดาร์คไซด์
ฟังรวดเดียวจบ ตกใจมากเลยครับ
ว่าทำไม มันจบเร็วจัง
ใครมีอาการแบบผมบ้างเอ่ย

[.. polotoon ..]

ผมไม่ได้ฟังจบทั้งอัลบั้ม รวดเดียว มานานแล้วครับ

[เพชร วิปลาส]

วันก่อนเปิดแผ่น ดาร์คไซด์
ฟังรวดเดียวจบ ตกใจมากเลยครับ
ว่าทำไม มันจบเร็วจัง
ใครมีอาการแบบผมบ้างเอ่ย

เป็นเหมือนกันครับพี่ รู้สึกไม่อินเหมือนตอนแรกๆด้วย จนพาลอยากจะกดข้ามหลายครั้ง
สงสัยไปติดกับที่ดรีมเธียเตอร์คัพเวอร์มากเกินไป 

[TRON]

วันก่อนเปิดแผ่น ดาร์คไซด์
ฟังรวดเดียวจบ ตกใจมากเลยครับ
ว่าทำไม มันจบเร็วจัง
ใครมีอาการแบบผมบ้างเอ่ย

ยังฟังจบได้เรื่อยๆและรู้สึกแบบพี่แจ๊คเหมือนกันในช่วงระยะหลังๆ เพราะอัลบั้มสมัยนี้ยาว 60-70 นาทีไม่เหมือนสมัยก่อน เราเลยรู้สึกว่าอัลบั้มนี้มันสั้น เพราะสมัยก่อนความจุแผ่นเสียงถ้าไม่ให้เสียงด้อยคุณภาพมากความยาวก็ไม่ควรเกิน 50 นาที แต่ผมชอบนะ มันกระชับดี ไม่เยิ่นเย้อ ไม่รู้สึกว่าเป็นอัลบั้มจับยัดให้มันเยอะ เรียกว่าคุณภาพทุกเพลง

[kongbei]

Storm Thorgerson dies aged 69
British graphic designer was responsible for some of the most memorable album artwork of all time

David Batty
The Guardian, Thursday 18 April 2013 22.49 BST



Storm Thorgerson, whose album cover artwork includes Pink Floyd's The Dark Side of the Moon, has died aged 69, Photograph: Yui Mok/PA
Storm Thorgerson, the British graphic designer behind some of the most memorable album covers of all time, including Pink Floyd's The Dark Side of the Moon, has died aged 69.

The designer, who also created artwork for bands and musicians including Led Zeppelin, Peter Gabriel and Muse over his 40 year career, died peacefully after having been ill for some time with cancer.

Thorgerson began his career with UK design group Hipgnosis, founded in the late 1960s, and his distinctive style made him one of the industry's most recognisable artists.

A childhood friend of the founding members of Pink Floyd, he became their designer-in-chief, most famously creating the prism spreading a spectrum of colour across the cover of The Dark Side of the Moon, which became one of the bestselling albums of all time. His artwork for the band also included the lonesome-looking cow on the cover of Atom Heart Mother, the burning businessman on the sleeve of Wish You Were Here, and the giant pig flying over Battersea power station on the cover of Animals.

In a statement, Thorgerson's family said he died peacefully on Thursday surrounded by family and friends.

"He had been ill for some time with cancer though he had made a remarkable recovery from his stroke in 2003," the statement said. "He is survived by his mother Vanji, his son Bill, his wife Barbie Antonis and her two children Adam and Georgia."

Pink Floyd guitarist and singer Dave Gilmour said in a statement on his website that Thorgerson's artwork for the band had been "an inseparable part of our work".

He said: "We first met in our early teens. We would gather at Sheep's Green, a spot by the river in Cambridge, and Storm would always be there holding forth, making the most noise, bursting with ideas and enthusiasm. Nothing has ever really changed.

"He has been a constant force in my life, both at work and in private, a shoulder to cry on and a great friend. I will miss him."

A statement on the official Pink Floyd website said: "We are saddened by the news that long-time Pink Floyd graphic genius, friend and collaborator, Storm Thorgerson, has died. Our thoughts are with his family and many friends."

[TRON]

R.I.P.

[panyarak]

ปกนี้ออกแบบไว้ให้อัลบั้มรวมเพลงของ Pink Floyd แต่ไม่ได้ใช้ครับ

[TRON]

ไปเสริช์เจอมา สำหรับเกร็ดเล็กน้อยสำหรับคนสะสมซีดี Pink Floyd ครับ

Hi everyone,

I registered some time ago, but never posted on the forum before. I wanted to do it when I was able to make a really informative and interesting post or thread. I think this is the case, so this is my first post.

Some time ago I read the threads and posts regarding the virtual “inexistence” of the Pink Floyd 1992-1995 Doug Sax remastered CDs in european markets, apart from the Shine On box. Apparently, some of the proper remasters were released in the US in 1997 by Columbia and were never ever released in the EU, no matter that the artwork stated otherwise. Especially interesting was the case of Animals, which in Europe seems to be an old UK Harvest mastering (even in the “Oh by the Way” box) instead of the great-sounding Sax remaster released in 1997 in the US.

When I read those things, I was worried. Why?, because in my country (Chile) we get the European releases of the Pink Floyd CDs, so I wondered “what if I have the old-master discs, instead of the remastered ones?”, what if, back in the old ‘90s, I bought old-mastered Pink Floyd albums believing that they were the Sax Remasters (as it is stated in the artwork of ALL of them)?

Then I decided to do a little research, using as a main source of information my own collection, and working with the Pink Floyd CDs from “Piper” to AMLOR that I own and, supposedly, are Sax remasters.

Here is the list of the Sax remasters I have, with catalog numbers, label and place of release:

Piper at the Gates of Dawn:
7243 8 31261 2 5 – EMI – Europe

A Saucerful of Secrets:
7243 8 29751 2 0 – EMI – Europe
CDP 0777 7 46383 2 6 – USA - Capitol

Music from the film More:
7243 8 35631 2 8 – EMI – Europe
CDP 0777 7 46386 2 3 – USA – Capitol

Ummagumma:
7243 8 31213 2 7/8 – EMI – Europe
CDP 0777 7 46404 2 8 – Capitol - USA

Atom Heart Mother:
7243 8 31246 2 6 – EMI – Europe

Relics:
7243 8 35603 2 5 – EMI – Europe
CDP 7243 8 35603 2 5 – Capitol - USA

Meddle:
7243 8 29749 2 5 – EMI – Europe

Obscured by Clouds:
7243 8 35609 2 9 – EMI – Europe

Dark Side of the Moon
7243 8 29752 2 9 – EMI – Europe

Wish you Were Here:
7243 8 29750 2 1 – EMI – Europe
CK 68522 – Columbia – USA

Animals:
7243 8 29748 2 6 – EMI – Europe
CK 68521 – Columbia - USA

The Wall:
7243 8 31243 2 9 – EMI – Europe
C2K 68519 – Columbia - USA

The Final Cut:
7243 8 31242 2 0 – EMI – Europe
CK 68517 – Columbia – USA

A Momentary Lapse of Reason:
CDK 68581 – Columbia – USA


Before we get to the results, please keep some information in mind:

1.- This analysis refers ONLY to the market releases of the remastered CDs, that means independent CDs and NOT those in the US and/or EU editions of the Shine On Box.

2.- In cases when I didn’t have the EU or US counterpart of an album to compare, I used the EAC peak levels information available in the excellent database of Vernon Fitch’s website to make the comparisons. That is stated alongside the album’s data as “PFA”.

3.- All of the CDs here reviewed (except for the 1997 Columbia releases) clearly state in the artwork that they are “Digital Remasters” from 1992, 1994 or 1995 and credited to Doug Sax. All of the Columbia CDs here reviewed don’t state that in the artwork, but have the 1997 “Anniversary Edition” round sticker in the jewel case and have “1997” written in the copyright legal statement.


So, let’s see the results:

Piper at the Gates of Dawn:
Europe: 100 / 91.3 / 100 / 93.3 / 96.9 / 92.4 / 100 / 87.5 / 85.1 / 80.5 / 100
USA: 100 / 91.3 / 100 / 93.3 / 96.9 / 92.4 / 100 / 87.5 / 85.1 / 80.5 / 100 (PFA)
Peak levels are identical.

A Saucerful of Secrets:
Europe: 86.7 / 70.8 / 82.7 / 86.8 / 86.7 / 89.2 / 54.4
USA: 100 / 98.4 / 93.3 / 95.7 / 89.9 / 94.6 / 75.7
Peak levels are different. Also, “Set the Controls” have a really awkward cut/paste sound in the middle part in the European release. This is not present in the US release.

Music from the film More:
Europe: 68.7 / 100 / 62.4 / 100 / 86.0 / 72.1 / 74.1 / 99.9 / 100 / 97.2 / 73.6 / 97.2 / 100
USA: 68.7 / 100 / 62.4 / 100 / 86.0 / 72.1 / 74.1 / 99.9 / 100 / 97.2 / 73.6 / 97.2 / 100
Peak levels are identical.

Ummagumma:
Disc 1
Europe: 100 / 100 / 100 / 100
USA: 100 / 100 / 100 / 100

Disc2
Europe: 90.1 / 65.6 / 70.7 / 86.9 / 100 / 86.8 / 80.1 / 99.4 / 100 / 83.6 / 100 / 54.9
USA: 90.1 / 65.6 / 70.7 / 86.9 / 100 / 86.8 / 80.1 / 99.4 / 100 / 83.6 / 100 / 54.9
Peak levels are identical in both discs.

Atom Heart Mother:
Europe: 100 / 74.2 / 100 / 100 / 100
USA: 100 / 74.2 / 100 / 100 / 100 (PFA)
Peak levels are identical.

Relics:
Europe: 89.3 / 92.2 / 84.1 / 100 / 75.6 / 96.2 / 87.4 / 62.7 / 100 / 100 / 74.5
USA: 89.3 / 92.2 / 84.1 / 100 / 75.6 / 96.2 / 87.4 / 62.7 / 100 / 100 / 74.5
Peak levels are identical.

Meddle:
Europe: 82.2 / 56.5 / 97.7 / 96.8 / 42.8 / 97.7
USA: 100 / 79.4 / 100 / 100 / 70.8 / 96.9 (PFA)
Peak levels are different.

Obscured by Clouds:
Europe: 84.6 / 94.7 / 86.5 / 100 / 99.3 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100
USA: 84.6 / 94.7 / 86.5 / 100.0 / 99.3 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 (PFA)
Peak levels are identical.

Dark Side of the Moon:
Europe: 87.8 / 94.7 / 100 / 97.2 / 100 / 99.1 / 97.7 / 93.9 / 97.7
USA: 67.9 / 69.1 / 76.9 / 75 / 96.8 / 69.6 / 89.3 / 75.7 / 82.5 (PFA)
Peak levels are different.

Wish you Were Here:
Europe: 97.7 / 97.7 / 97.7 / 97.7 / 97.7
USA: 100 / 100 / 99.9 / 88.8 / 92.2
Peak levels are different.

Animals:
Europe: 48.3 / 82.7 / 64.8 / 75.7 / 32.4
USA: 53.8 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 56.7
Peak levels are different.

The Wall:
Disc 1
Europe: 97.2 / 87.2 / 95.3 / 97.2 / 93.6 / 93.8 / 47.9 / 57.6 / 97.2 / 97.2 / 93.5 / 97.2 / 26.9
USA: 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 54.4 / 62.0 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 30.6

Disc 2
Europe: 95.0 / 65.9 / 61.9 / 48.8 / 90.2 / 95.4 / 78.8 / 97.2 / 97.2 / 97.2 / 18.7 / 85.7 / 11.5
USA: 100 / 75.6 / 69.7 / 53.8 / 100 / 100 / 84.2 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 19.4 / 100 / 17.0
Peak levels are different in both discs. European discs match the Italian release, although they have UK artwork.

The Final Cut:
Europe: 75.6 / 75.7 / 21.8 / 90.3 / 76.4 / 55.1 / 70.3 / 74.8 / 29.6 / 72.4 / 91.2 / 66.8
USA: 88.4 / 93.0 / 25.6 / 100.0 / 99.2 / 84.8 / 83.0 / 100.0 / 36.4 / 87.1 / 97.0 / 86.5
Peak levels are different.

A Momentary Lapse of Reason:
Europe: 64.1 / 100 / 88.8 / 85.2 / 83.1 / 97.6 / 39.9 / 97.5 / 38.8 / 90.9 (PFA)
USA: 72.7 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 100 / 62.7 / 100 / 55.9 / 100
Peak levels are different. However, there is no record of a “1994 remaster” in the European catalog of Vernon’s site, so I used the edition that was being sold at the same time as the 1997 Columbia issue to compare.

Conclusions.
The first conclusion I got from my analysis is that I have to replace my EMI “Meddle” with a Capitol CD. On the other hand, I have the Columbia 1997 releases so all I have to do is get rid of some of the bad sounding “un-remastered” EMI releases from WYWH to TFC. I got rid of the European Animals (that sounded REALLY bad) and Wish you Were Here (bad sound, really really bad sound), and am looking forward to get rid of the other European versions.

However, the main conclusion is not that. As we can see from the results, the following albums have different peak levels in EU and US: Saucerful of Secrets, Meddle, DSOTM, WYWH, Animals, The Wall, TFC and AMLOR. On the other hand, Piper, More, Ummagumma, AHM, Relics and OBC have the same peak levels in the US and the EU.

After doing some comparisons in Vernon’s site, and after reading some useful posts in this forum, I concluded that the European “remastered” release of Animals is actually an old UK Harvest mastering, WYWH is a level shifted old UK mastering, and something similar happens with Saucerful, Meddle, TFC, AMLOR and The Wall.

Now, some facts: Pink Floyd catalogue was licensed (until 2000) to 2 different companies in the USA: Capitol Records had the first half (Piper to Dark Side) and Columbia Records had the second half (WYWH to PULSE). In Europe, the entire Floyd catalogue was licensed to EMI. Doug Sax made some remasters in 1992 for the Shine On Box, and in 1994-1995 he remastered the rest of the catalogue. The first half (Piper to DSOTM) of these remasters were issued in the US by Capitol in 1994-1995 as independent CDs. The second half of the remasters (WYWH to AMLOR) were held back by Columbia until 1997. There was no 1997 remastering. The albums released in 1997 by Columbia are the Sax remasters from 1992-1995. In Europe, the whole “remastered” catalogue was issued between 1994 and 1996. However, as we’ve seen, only some of the albums released in Europe were real Sax remasters, and the majority were old masters in a new packaging.

So, the real Sax remasters of WYWH, Animals, TW, TFC and AMLOR weren’t released as independent CDs, in any place of Earth, until 1997. The real Sax remasters of Saucerful, Meddle and DSOTM were released as independent CDs only in the USA by Capitol in 1993-1994. And the real Sax remasters of the rest of the catalogue were released in 1993-1996 in the US and the EU by Capitol and EMI respectively.

It seems that all the albums that were in hands of Columbia in the US were NOT released as Sax remasters by EMI outside the US. Never. They still haven’t. And the same happened to the Sax remastered Capitol albums present in the Shine On box. What happened? I don’t really know. I can only guess. Probably some problems between labels, probably Columbia had the power to retain the remasters of their half of the catalogue and prevent EMI from releasing them worldwide, perhaps the remasters of the Capitol albums present on the Shine On box were only allowed to be released in the US and not by EMI. Or perhaps EMI just didn’t care about the remasters. Perhaps they chose to release the old mastered CDs (with a new artwork full of lies, by the way) than to pay somebody the rights for the remasters. Who knows what happened back in the early ‘90s?

I don’t. All I can say is this, if you want the REAL Sax remasters, you have the following choices:

- Get the US Capitol 1994-1995/Columbia 1997 releases. The Capitol 2000 releases are also good. They have the same remastering of the 1997 Columbia releases. There was NO new mastering in 2000. Only the Columbia contract ended and the rights went back to Capitol, and they re-released the albums under their label and with the Sax remastering. This doesn’t apply to the 2005 AMLOR, that’s another story.

- If you are not in the USA, you can be sure that the European releases of Piper, More, Ummagumma, Relics, AHM and OBC are the real Sax remasters. For the other albums, you can try to get a Shine On box (Sax mastering, a little level shifted though, but fine) or import the US or Japanese releases of the independent CDs. Avoid, at any extent, European releases of the other CDs or the "Oh By the Way" box (it contains the European pressings, so you’ll get a 1980’s Animals in a nice 2007’s box).

That’s it. I hope this helps someone (maybe a Sax fan trying to get all of the the “Sax Floyd”), and really hope that this thread can be of good use in this forum. I did all this work some time ago for myself, to be clear of what CDs I should look for and what CDs I had to get rid of, and now I wanted to share my results and conclusions.

Cheers!!

[TRON]

Sax remasters were the last major remastering of the PF catalog (before 2011 remaster). With the exceptions of Piper (2007), DSOTM (2003), The Final Cut (2004) and AMLOR (2005), there are no new remasterings. And, compared to those new masterings, Sax are, IMHO, better (with the exception of the DSOTM 5.1 layer, of course).

However, as Sander said, there are better sounding versions for most of the PF catalog (Japanese 1st or 2nd pressings, or some MFSL editions for example). The problem is that some of them are really expensive and hard to find. Sax remasters, on the other hand, are easier to find and usually are at a reasonable price (good price/quality relation). Other pressings at similar prices tend to be of inferior quality, IMO, with some very honorable exceptions, of course, mainly some early US and German pressings. So, if you have the true Sax remasters and they sound fine for your ears, then you don't need to upgrade anything.

It's a matter of tastes, anyways

Shine On is all Doug Sax, but with different peak levels then the regular discs, and different peaks for Euro Shine On vs US Shine On. Nobody knows why.

Oh by the Way is the same in all markets, and is Doug Sax, except for:

James Guthrie:
Piper at the Gates of Dawn
The Dark Side of the Moon
The Final Cut

Unknown, but maybe tweaked Doug Sax:
The Wall

80's EMI Mastering:
A Saucerful of Secrets
Meddle
Wish You Were Here
Animals

This mirrors the current Euro individual releases.

Again, nobody knows why, or if EMI even knows what they're pressing anymore.

[TRON]

โดยส่วนตัวผมไม่ชอบงานรีมาสเตอร์ของนาย James Guthrie 3 ชุดนี้เลยครับ (ไม่นับพวก surround 5.1 เปรียบเทียบเฉพาะ stereo)

Piper at the Gates of Dawn 2007
The Dark Side of the Moon 2003
The Final Cut 2004

มันฟังดูแข็งๆคมๆดิจิคอลเกินและคอมเพรสเสียมันรกหูหน่อยๆ งานรีมาสเตอร์ของ Sax ฟังรื่นหูกว่ามากจริงๆ ส่วนรีมาสเตอร์ยกเซ็ทล่าสุดปี 2011 ของ James Guthrie ถึงแม้จะลดความแข็งกระด้างลง แต่ผมก็ยังรู้สึกไม่คุ้นหูเอาเสียเลย เท่าที่สัมผัสมางานของ Sax คือ Pink Floyd เวอร์ชั่นซีดีที่ผมชอบมากที่สุด (ไม่นับชุด The Wall)

[TRON]

[TRON]

ข่าวล่าสุดว่ารายชื่อเพลงนี้อาจเป็นของปลอมนะครับ

[JKNoremorse]

คงไม่มีใครคิดว่าจะได้ฟังสตูดิโอใหม่ของ Pink Floyd อีกนะครับ

[TRON]

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3DTessB3ns" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3DTessB3ns</a>

[TRON]